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I am reminded of the "rotten boroughs" in British politics which gave the likes of WInston Chruchill their start. I understand the "pot wallopers" have been dispersed and the "rotten boroughs" eliminated.
I am in sympathy with the views expressed in this article but I think a map showing population density would be helpful. We may have "tyranny of the majority".
Posted by Warrington Faust at February 13, 2013 5:12 PM
I think we should go back. The SC's logic that "Legislators are elected by voters, not farms or cities [. . .]" goes away if the legislators are specifically appointed by Mayors or Town/City councils (preferably with short (1 year?) terms and restrictions on the same person being appointed more than once out of every 3 years, to maintain the power of the cities post appointment). It's a perverse system, overall, where some of the largest recipients of state outlays get no voice in that distribution. Municipalities deserve representation.
You could even grant the largest cities (by size, not by name) additional representatives to smooth out the population differential.
Posted by Mario at February 13, 2013 5:13 PM
What a bunch of bullshit from Huffman. He is a salesman for big mining. The so called Disenfranchisement of Rural America is nothing more than a power play by the largest multinational corporations to exert even more control and political power at the local and national level. But since RI was brought up in this I thought that this early historical account would be relevant.
The Blackstone River Valley of Massachusetts and Rhode Island is the “Birthplace of the American Industrial Revolution,” the place where America made the transformation from Farm to Factory. America’s first textile mill could have been built along practically any river on the eastern seaboard, but in 1790 the forces of capital, ingenuity, mechanical know-how and skilled labor came together at Pawtucket, Rhode Island where the Blackstone River provided the power that kicked off America’s drive to industrialization.
In 1789, Providence merchant Moses Brown was attempting to build a new factory to spin cotton fiber into thread at the falls of the Blackstone River in Pawtucket, RI. Along with a source of water power, Pawtucket also had a century old tradition as home to tool and machine makers, and Brown had plenty of capital to invest in the project. However, months of work led only to frustration, Then in December 1789, Brown hired Samuel Slater, a recent immigrant from England. Slater had spent seven years working in a textile mill in England, rising to the position of overseer of machinery and mill construction. When he arrived in Pawtucket, Slater determined that Brown’s machinery would not work, but Slater was convinced that he could modify it into working order. He set to work and one year later in December 1790 the experimental mill was in operation - the first successful water powered cotton-spinning factory in the United States, and the beginning of a new age of industrialization.
The success of the Slater Mill inspired other entrepreneurs to build their own mills, first throughout the Blackstone Valley and then eventually all over New England. To take advantage of water power sources, new mill villages were built where once only field and forest stood.
Here investors built not only mills, but homes, schools and churches for their workers. The lifestyle changes for these new mill workers, mostly Yankee farmers, were dramatic. On the farm, the seasons and the sun governed the workday. Once in the mill, the rhythm of nature was replaced by the tolling of the factory bell. Time became a commodity, to be strictly measured and sold at a set rate. The artisan’s skill or farmer’s produce no longer had as much value as the sheer amount of time a worker was able to stand beside their ceaseless machine.
www.nps.gov/blac/historyculture/index.htm
Posted by David S at February 15, 2013 7:44 PM
I can't quote a good source for this, but I always understood that British mill machinery was a closely guarded industrial secret and that Brown "bought him out". Seems strange to think that anyone, such as Slater, reached a high position and then simply departed, without prospects, for Pawtucket, RI. I think the site quoted cleans him up a bit.
The Blackstone was selected over competitors, it was not by happenstance. Although short, the Blackstone "falls" at a far greater degree than most rivers. This increases the flow, or power, of the river. This makes extraordinarily expensive "mill ponds" unnecessary. It would have drawn mill builders from afar, much as the isolated rivers of Vermont did. Unfortunately they were textile mills, more sensitive to labor costs than power supply, so they moved first to North Carolina and now the Orient. Much the same happened to Oriental Rugs after the Germans "industrialized" them with their aniline dyes during the 1800's in "Persia". Seeking cheap hand labor, production went to Pakistan, then India and now China.
As to New England farmers. As anyone who has actually farmed here knows, what New England grows is rocks. Regardless of the Industrial Age, most "real farmers" in New England departed for the Mid-West (no glacial erratics) about 1850.
Posted by Warrington Faust at February 15, 2013 10:18 PM
If the tax money of people who do not live in cities,such as Providence,must go to help support cities such as Providence,then we have a situation of taxation without representation,because those who live in other towns and cities cannot vote in the elections of places such as Providence.
Posted by helen at February 17, 2013 6:15 AM
David S,
It's all nothing but an intellectual exercise for you. That's obvious because you do not speak from experience. It's just a political football for you. However,it is true that how long you can stand at a machine is your paltry worth.
I can't do it long,I faint.
Posted by helen at February 17, 2013 6:23 AM
"...Mostly Yankee farmers."
You quoted this from some "authority",well,what about all of the legal immigrants who had to work in these hell holes to barely survive? I guess they don't merit mention.
I am reminded of the "rotten boroughs" in British politics which gave the likes of WInston Chruchill their start. I understand the "pot wallopers" have been dispersed and the "rotten boroughs" eliminated.
I am in sympathy with the views expressed in this article but I think a map showing population density would be helpful. We may have "tyranny of the majority".
Posted by Warrington Faust at February 13, 2013 5:12 PMI think we should go back. The SC's logic that "Legislators are elected by voters, not farms or cities [. . .]" goes away if the legislators are specifically appointed by Mayors or Town/City councils (preferably with short (1 year?) terms and restrictions on the same person being appointed more than once out of every 3 years, to maintain the power of the cities post appointment). It's a perverse system, overall, where some of the largest recipients of state outlays get no voice in that distribution. Municipalities deserve representation.
You could even grant the largest cities (by size, not by name) additional representatives to smooth out the population differential.
Posted by Mario at February 13, 2013 5:13 PMWhat a bunch of bullshit from Huffman. He is a salesman for big mining. The so called Disenfranchisement of Rural America is nothing more than a power play by the largest multinational corporations to exert even more control and political power at the local and national level. But since RI was brought up in this I thought that this early historical account would be relevant.
Posted by David S at February 15, 2013 7:44 PMThe Blackstone River Valley of Massachusetts and Rhode Island is the “Birthplace of the American Industrial Revolution,” the place where America made the transformation from Farm to Factory. America’s first textile mill could have been built along practically any river on the eastern seaboard, but in 1790 the forces of capital, ingenuity, mechanical know-how and skilled labor came together at Pawtucket, Rhode Island where the Blackstone River provided the power that kicked off America’s drive to industrialization.
In 1789, Providence merchant Moses Brown was attempting to build a new factory to spin cotton fiber into thread at the falls of the Blackstone River in Pawtucket, RI. Along with a source of water power, Pawtucket also had a century old tradition as home to tool and machine makers, and Brown had plenty of capital to invest in the project. However, months of work led only to frustration, Then in December 1789, Brown hired Samuel Slater, a recent immigrant from England. Slater had spent seven years working in a textile mill in England, rising to the position of overseer of machinery and mill construction. When he arrived in Pawtucket, Slater determined that Brown’s machinery would not work, but Slater was convinced that he could modify it into working order. He set to work and one year later in December 1790 the experimental mill was in operation - the first successful water powered cotton-spinning factory in the United States, and the beginning of a new age of industrialization.
The success of the Slater Mill inspired other entrepreneurs to build their own mills, first throughout the Blackstone Valley and then eventually all over New England. To take advantage of water power sources, new mill villages were built where once only field and forest stood.
Here investors built not only mills, but homes, schools and churches for their workers. The lifestyle changes for these new mill workers, mostly Yankee farmers, were dramatic. On the farm, the seasons and the sun governed the workday. Once in the mill, the rhythm of nature was replaced by the tolling of the factory bell. Time became a commodity, to be strictly measured and sold at a set rate. The artisan’s skill or farmer’s produce no longer had as much value as the sheer amount of time a worker was able to stand beside their ceaseless machine.
www.nps.gov/blac/historyculture/index.htm
I can't quote a good source for this, but I always understood that British mill machinery was a closely guarded industrial secret and that Brown "bought him out". Seems strange to think that anyone, such as Slater, reached a high position and then simply departed, without prospects, for Pawtucket, RI. I think the site quoted cleans him up a bit.
The Blackstone was selected over competitors, it was not by happenstance. Although short, the Blackstone "falls" at a far greater degree than most rivers. This increases the flow, or power, of the river. This makes extraordinarily expensive "mill ponds" unnecessary. It would have drawn mill builders from afar, much as the isolated rivers of Vermont did. Unfortunately they were textile mills, more sensitive to labor costs than power supply, so they moved first to North Carolina and now the Orient. Much the same happened to Oriental Rugs after the Germans "industrialized" them with their aniline dyes during the 1800's in "Persia". Seeking cheap hand labor, production went to Pakistan, then India and now China.
As to New England farmers. As anyone who has actually farmed here knows, what New England grows is rocks. Regardless of the Industrial Age, most "real farmers" in New England departed for the Mid-West (no glacial erratics) about 1850.
Posted by Warrington Faust at February 15, 2013 10:18 PM
Posted by helen at February 17, 2013 6:15 AMIf the tax money of people who do not live in cities,such as Providence,must go to help support cities such as Providence,then we have a situation of taxation without representation,because those who live in other towns and cities cannot vote in the elections of places such as Providence.
David S,
It's all nothing but an intellectual exercise for you. That's obvious because you do not speak from experience. It's just a political football for you. However,it is true that how long you can stand at a machine is your paltry worth.
I can't do it long,I faint.
Posted by helen at February 17, 2013 6:23 AM"...Mostly Yankee farmers."
You quoted this from some "authority",well,what about all of the legal immigrants who had to work in these hell holes to barely survive? I guess they don't merit mention.
Posted by helen at February 17, 2013 6:59 AM